Proficiency level after 10+ years of Chinese study.

I am about to start my 10th year of Chinese study, so I wanted to ask others who have studied for a few years or longer: do you consider yourself fluent? At what point did that happen for you?

I ask because my Chinese seems to involve a range of proficiency levels. There are some days where I feel fluent and others where I still feel like I still have a long way to go. For example:

• Reading: I can read novels quite fluently in both simplified and traditional Chinese, with, on average 2 or fewer unknown words per page. On the other hand, there are often (what seem like really basic) signs and menus I come across where I can't read a single word.
• Listening: I can understand 95% of what I hear in a live conversation with another person, and 90% of what I hear in a podcast, but when I overhear two other people speaking to each other at work for example (neither speaking to me) my comprehension can be as low as 30%.
• Writing: I can get my point across 95% of the time, but I still don't feel comfortable writing in the passive voice or using chengyu or other complex phrases (they don't come to me naturally when speaking).
• Speaking: Similar to my writing ability, I can get my point across and have no trouble being understood in 95% of situations, but I still cringe when hearing a recording of myself speaking (when it's played back I pick up on all of the small errors I make that I just gloss over when I'm actually speaking to someone else).

Has anyone actually gotten to the point where they felt "I made it, I'm totally satisfied with my level"? If so, what was the experience like?

This matches my own experience, I think your level is a bit higher than mine, but I see the same kind of varying fluency.

It always depends on many things, when talking with my tutors I also understand 95%, when listening to podcasts for learners like 還可中文 as well, but if it's a podcast for native speakers it really depends on the topic. Once they talk about more specialized topics with many specific terms, I can understand 70% of the words and 10-20% of the content. Same for strong accents that I am not used to, I pick up some words and know it's Mandarin, but can't really follow along.

Reading is less critical since the speed only depends on you, characters contain more information and can be looked up easily, if necessary. But with a higher level you probably also want to tackle more challenging material, first you struggle to make it through 活著 and then you feel that by now reading 金庸 should be possible.

With speaking and writing it's similar, at my current level I can discuss pretty much any topic with my tutors, but that also means that I reach the limits of my vocabulary more often. This can be a bit frustrating, but pushing the boundaries is part of learning.

In the beginning you stay in the textbook lane and progress can be measured in chapters, once you reach the native wilderness, progress becomes less visible, even though it's there.

So personally I am definitely not "totally satisfied" with my level and probably never will be. But as long as I enjoy learning Chinese, that doesn't really matter.

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On the other hand, there are often (what seem like really basic) signs and menus I come across where I can't read a single word.

Menus are a vocabulary of their own.  Often they're comprised of names of dishes that are meaningless linguistically unless you've eaten in that place before or are familiar with popular dishes.  My husband is a native Chinese speaker and gets pretty baffled looking at an all-Chinese menu because he never went to restaurants much before he left China.

If you want to learn "menu talk" you would need to study menus specifically.  Pictures or videos might help.

I would say everything you have written also applies to me. I find regional differences to be the key barrier to comprehension in most speech-based interactions: it's not just the accent, it's the fundamental difference in thought and choice of expression. We're all speaking 'putonghua', yet there is still so much misunderstanding even between native Chinese speakers who are strangers from different regions of china. Everyone is constantly dipping into their local language to make up for the lack of clarity in the national standard, particularly when it comes to niche/specialist topics. I was floored only a few days ago when a person from Tianjin was speaking to me and I could not process what he was saying to me at all, despite having known him for over 5 years now!

TBZ, Thanks for those kind words!

No need to thank me, you earned every fan-boy word...

TBZ

I've been going for about 15 years now, and I think most people here are much higher proficiency than I am. 

Granted, I've been in maintenance mode for about 5 years now. 

I can read novels, some with ease, others not so much. I've tried a range of things, and some were pretty OK (Gu Long novels, Cao Wenxuan novels) and others were more trying (Jin Yong, Liu Cixing). 

My speaking is alright. Most people can understand me. I can expressive myself "basically" very comfortably and make small talk with ease, but I'm totally lost when it comes to professional topics and higher level topics. 

Writing - I don't do it much. 

Listening - my worst. I often find I'm OK in one-on-one conversation, but monologues and even dialogues on unfamiliar content become total mysteries to me. 

I suppose I'm suck in some kind of intermediate hell - and yes I know that everyone considers themselves "intermediate". 

My issue is that, around 5 years ago, I lost the spark to learn. 

I loved learning in undergrad and grad school, and private tutors filled the gap for a few years after that, but I have a lot of other things I'm interested in, like music and literature (not necessarily Chinese). I've also got a full-time job, and a family to support.

I've got certain interests that would lend themselves to using my Chinese - like a relatively new interest in Buddhism, as well as an interest in literature. I just don't really know how to use my Chinese to explore these interests and find a way where I can practice Chinese other than through purely educational materials. 

@PerpetualChange Sounds like you're essentially at a 'ready-to-be-advanced-level' stage where if you moved to China everything would fall in place pretty quickly with exposure. If you can have small talk with ease, you'd get bored of that pretty quick living in China, so the desire to learn about deeper topics would naturally creep to the surface. For me, the calligraphy and tea communities have been the reason I have yet to lose my drive, there's always one more reason to get frustrated and go away and learn some more high register stuff so I can 'play with the adults'!

On 9/11/2025 at 9:08 PM, PerpetualChange said:

an interest in literature. I just don't really know how to use my Chinese to explore these interests

Is the issue that you don't find any Chinese books that interest you? I have a similar fear because I also learn Chinese mostly for reading, but so far (~4 years in) I haven't run out of them. For Buddhism I recommend 金刚经说什么 by 南怀瑾, I couldn't finish it because it was too hard for me at the time but I plan on trying again some day.

On 9/11/2025 at 8:57 PM, Tomsima said:

@PerpetualChange Sounds like you're essentially at a 'ready-to-be-advanced-level' stage where if you moved to China everything would fall in place pretty quickly with exposure. If you can have small talk with ease, you'd get bored of that pretty quick living in China, so the desire to learn about deeper topics would naturally creep to the surface. For me, the calligraphy and tea communities have been the reason I have yet to lose my drive, there's always one more reason to get frustrated and go away and learn some more high register stuff so I can 'play with the adults'!

Thanks! I lived in Hong Kong for a few years with a roommate who mostly spoke Mandarin, but otherwise, I found I was still exposed to a ton of English, logically! 

I think if I had stayed longer or gone to mainland or Taiwan from there, I'd definitely be much better off!

On 9/12/2025 at 3:12 AM, lordsuso said:

Is the issue that you don't find any Chinese books that interest you? I have a similar fear because I also learn Chinese mostly for reading, but so far (~4 years in) I haven't run out of them. For Buddhism I recommend 金刚经说什么 by 南怀瑾, I couldn't finish it because it was too hard for me at the time but I plan on trying again some day.

I've been a bit discouraged by how long books have taken me to work through. I'd been on the lookout for some materials about Buddhism or Daoism, perhaps designed for elementary or middle school children, as I feel those would probably be at my level to read comfortably. I'll check out the book, thanks!